What criteria should be taken into account when selecting nodes to create new lightning channels with?












4














Alex Bosworth recently pointed out:




I see people connect to a "well connected" node on LN and by that they mean they connect to a node with lots of channels. The number of channels is actually a contra-indicator of a node's ability to route. Good routers curate and balance. Bad routers spam the open channel button. [Emphasis added]




What criteria should be kept in mind when evaluating nodes while opening new channels on the lightning network?










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    4














    Alex Bosworth recently pointed out:




    I see people connect to a "well connected" node on LN and by that they mean they connect to a node with lots of channels. The number of channels is actually a contra-indicator of a node's ability to route. Good routers curate and balance. Bad routers spam the open channel button. [Emphasis added]




    What criteria should be kept in mind when evaluating nodes while opening new channels on the lightning network?










    share|improve this question

























      4












      4








      4







      Alex Bosworth recently pointed out:




      I see people connect to a "well connected" node on LN and by that they mean they connect to a node with lots of channels. The number of channels is actually a contra-indicator of a node's ability to route. Good routers curate and balance. Bad routers spam the open channel button. [Emphasis added]




      What criteria should be kept in mind when evaluating nodes while opening new channels on the lightning network?










      share|improve this question













      Alex Bosworth recently pointed out:




      I see people connect to a "well connected" node on LN and by that they mean they connect to a node with lots of channels. The number of channels is actually a contra-indicator of a node's ability to route. Good routers curate and balance. Bad routers spam the open channel button. [Emphasis added]




      What criteria should be kept in mind when evaluating nodes while opening new channels on the lightning network?







      lightning-network lightning-routing ln-opening-channels ln-topology






      share|improve this question













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      share|improve this question










      asked Jan 4 at 9:45









      MurchMurch

      34.7k27112324




      34.7k27112324






















          2 Answers
          2






          active

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          5














          I agree with Alex Bosworth and I have pointed this out about one year ago when I have filed an issue about the strategy used by the LND autopilot which basically looks for nodes with a high channel count. This is one of the reasons why I have created a standalone autopilot and provided an integration for c-lightning.



          There are several kind of information we can look at (my autopilot currently only looks at the first ones):




          1. Network topology:


            • How can I increase my centrality (e.g. by connecting to central nodes)

            • How can I increase my probability to have well funded routes by connecting to points where a lot of liquidity is floating around

            • Improve the network topology by increasing the amount of triangles

            • Geography: It is likely that you pay to services where you live and therefor you might want to connect to nodes that have a similar geoip as yours.



          2. Node Provenance / properties:


            • age of Node (seen by oldest channels)

            • age of channels (seen by the blockheight of funding transactions)

            • uptime of the node (can be tracked via the gossip messages and the gossip store)

            • Routing fees of the node

            • Reliability of the node to forward payments (can be tracked by doing fake 1 satoshi payments to yourself over different routes)




          most of the stuff that I mentioned here has been taken from my blog article about autopilots. In general I hope that better autopilots will emerge because I think this problem will be hard to decide by humans without investing a lot of time.



          Finally another strategy could be to create routing tables in a similar way as the border gateway protocol does on top of IP. In that case nodes would share partial information about the channel balance so that we would have a better overview of where liquidity is missing.






          share|improve this answer





























            1














            Here there are some properties:



            Node reliability: On-line connected 24/7.
            History: when the node came online for first time.
            Routing: How many channels has the node.
            Capacity: How much capacity can the handle through channels





            share|improve this answer










            New contributor




            Carlos Roldan is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
            Check out our Code of Conduct.


















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              2 Answers
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              2 Answers
              2






              active

              oldest

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              active

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              active

              oldest

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              5














              I agree with Alex Bosworth and I have pointed this out about one year ago when I have filed an issue about the strategy used by the LND autopilot which basically looks for nodes with a high channel count. This is one of the reasons why I have created a standalone autopilot and provided an integration for c-lightning.



              There are several kind of information we can look at (my autopilot currently only looks at the first ones):




              1. Network topology:


                • How can I increase my centrality (e.g. by connecting to central nodes)

                • How can I increase my probability to have well funded routes by connecting to points where a lot of liquidity is floating around

                • Improve the network topology by increasing the amount of triangles

                • Geography: It is likely that you pay to services where you live and therefor you might want to connect to nodes that have a similar geoip as yours.



              2. Node Provenance / properties:


                • age of Node (seen by oldest channels)

                • age of channels (seen by the blockheight of funding transactions)

                • uptime of the node (can be tracked via the gossip messages and the gossip store)

                • Routing fees of the node

                • Reliability of the node to forward payments (can be tracked by doing fake 1 satoshi payments to yourself over different routes)




              most of the stuff that I mentioned here has been taken from my blog article about autopilots. In general I hope that better autopilots will emerge because I think this problem will be hard to decide by humans without investing a lot of time.



              Finally another strategy could be to create routing tables in a similar way as the border gateway protocol does on top of IP. In that case nodes would share partial information about the channel balance so that we would have a better overview of where liquidity is missing.






              share|improve this answer


























                5














                I agree with Alex Bosworth and I have pointed this out about one year ago when I have filed an issue about the strategy used by the LND autopilot which basically looks for nodes with a high channel count. This is one of the reasons why I have created a standalone autopilot and provided an integration for c-lightning.



                There are several kind of information we can look at (my autopilot currently only looks at the first ones):




                1. Network topology:


                  • How can I increase my centrality (e.g. by connecting to central nodes)

                  • How can I increase my probability to have well funded routes by connecting to points where a lot of liquidity is floating around

                  • Improve the network topology by increasing the amount of triangles

                  • Geography: It is likely that you pay to services where you live and therefor you might want to connect to nodes that have a similar geoip as yours.



                2. Node Provenance / properties:


                  • age of Node (seen by oldest channels)

                  • age of channels (seen by the blockheight of funding transactions)

                  • uptime of the node (can be tracked via the gossip messages and the gossip store)

                  • Routing fees of the node

                  • Reliability of the node to forward payments (can be tracked by doing fake 1 satoshi payments to yourself over different routes)




                most of the stuff that I mentioned here has been taken from my blog article about autopilots. In general I hope that better autopilots will emerge because I think this problem will be hard to decide by humans without investing a lot of time.



                Finally another strategy could be to create routing tables in a similar way as the border gateway protocol does on top of IP. In that case nodes would share partial information about the channel balance so that we would have a better overview of where liquidity is missing.






                share|improve this answer
























                  5












                  5








                  5






                  I agree with Alex Bosworth and I have pointed this out about one year ago when I have filed an issue about the strategy used by the LND autopilot which basically looks for nodes with a high channel count. This is one of the reasons why I have created a standalone autopilot and provided an integration for c-lightning.



                  There are several kind of information we can look at (my autopilot currently only looks at the first ones):




                  1. Network topology:


                    • How can I increase my centrality (e.g. by connecting to central nodes)

                    • How can I increase my probability to have well funded routes by connecting to points where a lot of liquidity is floating around

                    • Improve the network topology by increasing the amount of triangles

                    • Geography: It is likely that you pay to services where you live and therefor you might want to connect to nodes that have a similar geoip as yours.



                  2. Node Provenance / properties:


                    • age of Node (seen by oldest channels)

                    • age of channels (seen by the blockheight of funding transactions)

                    • uptime of the node (can be tracked via the gossip messages and the gossip store)

                    • Routing fees of the node

                    • Reliability of the node to forward payments (can be tracked by doing fake 1 satoshi payments to yourself over different routes)




                  most of the stuff that I mentioned here has been taken from my blog article about autopilots. In general I hope that better autopilots will emerge because I think this problem will be hard to decide by humans without investing a lot of time.



                  Finally another strategy could be to create routing tables in a similar way as the border gateway protocol does on top of IP. In that case nodes would share partial information about the channel balance so that we would have a better overview of where liquidity is missing.






                  share|improve this answer












                  I agree with Alex Bosworth and I have pointed this out about one year ago when I have filed an issue about the strategy used by the LND autopilot which basically looks for nodes with a high channel count. This is one of the reasons why I have created a standalone autopilot and provided an integration for c-lightning.



                  There are several kind of information we can look at (my autopilot currently only looks at the first ones):




                  1. Network topology:


                    • How can I increase my centrality (e.g. by connecting to central nodes)

                    • How can I increase my probability to have well funded routes by connecting to points where a lot of liquidity is floating around

                    • Improve the network topology by increasing the amount of triangles

                    • Geography: It is likely that you pay to services where you live and therefor you might want to connect to nodes that have a similar geoip as yours.



                  2. Node Provenance / properties:


                    • age of Node (seen by oldest channels)

                    • age of channels (seen by the blockheight of funding transactions)

                    • uptime of the node (can be tracked via the gossip messages and the gossip store)

                    • Routing fees of the node

                    • Reliability of the node to forward payments (can be tracked by doing fake 1 satoshi payments to yourself over different routes)




                  most of the stuff that I mentioned here has been taken from my blog article about autopilots. In general I hope that better autopilots will emerge because I think this problem will be hard to decide by humans without investing a lot of time.



                  Finally another strategy could be to create routing tables in a similar way as the border gateway protocol does on top of IP. In that case nodes would share partial information about the channel balance so that we would have a better overview of where liquidity is missing.







                  share|improve this answer












                  share|improve this answer



                  share|improve this answer










                  answered Jan 4 at 11:39









                  Rene PickhardtRene Pickhardt

                  53212




                  53212























                      1














                      Here there are some properties:



                      Node reliability: On-line connected 24/7.
                      History: when the node came online for first time.
                      Routing: How many channels has the node.
                      Capacity: How much capacity can the handle through channels





                      share|improve this answer










                      New contributor




                      Carlos Roldan is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
                      Check out our Code of Conduct.























                        1














                        Here there are some properties:



                        Node reliability: On-line connected 24/7.
                        History: when the node came online for first time.
                        Routing: How many channels has the node.
                        Capacity: How much capacity can the handle through channels





                        share|improve this answer










                        New contributor




                        Carlos Roldan is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
                        Check out our Code of Conduct.





















                          1












                          1








                          1






                          Here there are some properties:



                          Node reliability: On-line connected 24/7.
                          History: when the node came online for first time.
                          Routing: How many channels has the node.
                          Capacity: How much capacity can the handle through channels





                          share|improve this answer










                          New contributor




                          Carlos Roldan is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
                          Check out our Code of Conduct.









                          Here there are some properties:



                          Node reliability: On-line connected 24/7.
                          History: when the node came online for first time.
                          Routing: How many channels has the node.
                          Capacity: How much capacity can the handle through channels






                          share|improve this answer










                          New contributor




                          Carlos Roldan is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
                          Check out our Code of Conduct.









                          share|improve this answer



                          share|improve this answer








                          edited 2 days ago









                          chytrik

                          6,3222624




                          6,3222624






                          New contributor




                          Carlos Roldan is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
                          Check out our Code of Conduct.









                          answered Jan 4 at 11:23









                          Carlos RoldanCarlos Roldan

                          111




                          111




                          New contributor




                          Carlos Roldan is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
                          Check out our Code of Conduct.





                          New contributor





                          Carlos Roldan is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
                          Check out our Code of Conduct.






                          Carlos Roldan is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
                          Check out our Code of Conduct.






























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